Exploring the limits of the NEO

[Chrislaf]

Today I flew my NEO over some rapids with an ND 64 filter hoping to get some blurred water shots (video and photos). It was a cold -14ºC with a brisk wind. Shortly after the flight began and over the rapids I got the error I got before when I flew the NEO in cold temps (-12ºC) - "Preparing to take off: IMU warming up. Wait before taking off". I did get some video and some photos but did not want to push my luck and returned and landed promptly just in case. I do have Care Refresh but still do not want to risk loosing my NEO.

This is the second time that I have got this error in temps colder than -10ºC and it surprises me as non of my other modern drones like my Mini 3 Pro and Mavic 3 Pro give this error when flown in weather that is colder than the rated specs.

When I got home I looked at the video and photos and the limits of the single axis gimbal became apparent - all of the photos and most of parts of the video was blurry when the NEO was being buffeted by a crosswind that maxed out at 13.68km/h which is well within the wind specs the NEO can handle. The results don't surprise me as there are other reports of the NEO's Rock Steady having difficulty stabilizing sideways movement.

Chris

 

[RcHawks]

Would having a second flight immediately afterwards help with the IMU warming issue at all?

 

[Chrislaf]

Would having a second flight immediately afterwards help with the IMU warming issue at all?

Not sure. I was on my way back home from Ottawa and didn’t have time for another flight. It’s supposed to be cold for the next few days so maybe I’ll try again but over land in case something happens.

Chris

 

[Droning on and on...]

As a general rule l, the smaller something is, the more susceptible it is to cold... The ratio of surface area to volume increases as things get smaller, so they shed heat faster.

 

[GFields]

You are a glutin for punishment

 

[Chrislaf]

As a general rule l, the smaller something is, the more susceptible it is to cold... The ratio of surface area to volume increases as things get smaller, so they shed heat faster.

That's true. It's interesting that I have never had these problems with my Mini 3 Pro, but it is a larger drone and the battery on it is more enclosed so the heat from it does not get dissipated as fast which is likely a factor.

Chris

 

[Chrislaf]

You are a glutin for punishment

Not really! Here, where I live these are typical temperatures for this time of year and often it is even colder. Today the temperature started off at -17ºC and it is currently -11ºC. I am usually prepared for flying in cold temps. I have hand warmers, insulated pants, etc. I also keep my flights short, fly within VLOS, and use automated settings on my drones that have them (eg. panos) so that I can keep my hands less exposed and warm.

I have been flying my NEO in conditions I would normally fly my other drones to see how it performs so that I can determine its limits and be better at judging the conditions and environments where I can fly it.

Chris

 

[RcHawks]

Very smart.

 

[Chrislaf]

Today I flew my NEO over the bay of a local lake which is freezing up. The temperature was -6C and I didn’t get any IMU errors. I will see if I can get a day when the temperature is -10C which is the lower limit and see if I get any errors.

Chris

 

[NealW]

Your post got me opening my Neo manual pdf and looking for the specs.

• Operating Temperature​

• -10° to 40° C (14° to 104° F)

Apparently you were up against the temperature limits. BRRR.......

Neal

 

[Chrislaf]

Yes, I am aware of the operating temperature limits as indicated in the specs but what I am trying to determine is the actual lower temperature limit. With my Mavic 3 Pro and Mini 3 Pro they also have -10ºC as the lower limit but I have flown them in lower temperatures without problems. My old P3S is spec'd to fly to a low of 0ºC but I have flown it in weather as cold as -25ºC and maybe even colder and it flew fine without any problems.

The two times I have flown the NEO in temperatures below -10ºC, I got the IMU errors so it seems that the lower limit of -10ºC may in fact be an actual limit. I still have not had a chance to fly in temperatures that are at -10ºC but may get a chance next week when the temperatures go back down again.

It is important to me to try to determine the lower limit so that when I go out flying, I know if I can use my NEO or not. Although, I have not seen any adverse effects from the IMU errors in temps below -10ºC, I do not want to take any chances and lose my drone.

Chris

 

[Chrislaf]

One of the things I have been interested in figuring out is whether the NEO could serve as a replacement for my Mini 3 Pro since in Canada both drones are classed the same. That is why I have been testing its limits especially when it is flown more like a traditional camera drone.

Today, I went out to an area lake that has been frozen over for about a month now. The temperature was -1ºC and it was very overcast and dull with calm conditions. I flew my Mavic 3 Pro first, then my Mini 3 Pro and finally the NEO in the same areas - a wide open space over a frozen lake. When I flew the NEO I set it to Cruise Control to try to make the video more cinematic but noticed that it was struggling and being buffeted around a bit. At 3m 2.5s into the flight I got the 'No Satellite Positioning' warning. At that point I had 8 satellites and was at a height of 45.9m. I watched the satellite signal closely and it continued to vary quite a bit to back up to 17 satellites at 3m 30.9s @56m and then back down again to 9 satellites at 59m. I started to get strong wind warnings when the wind speed was 5.4m/s. They continued until I brought the NEO down lower and put it into sport mode and started to fly back to the launch point but at 126m from home with 28% battery left I got a low battery warning.

I made it back without any problem but I am quickly discovering its limits especially when used like a traditional camera drone. I realize this is not really what the NEO was designed for.

Some of my observations so far:
•The minimum operating temperature seems to be pretty close to the specs stated in the manual (-10ºC) although I am still trying to determine this. The exposed battery does not help in cold temperatures.
•GPS signal stability even in a wide open space seems to fluctuate quite a bit whereas my other camera drones maintained a strong GPS signal throughout similar flights in the same area.
•NEO seems to struggle even in moderate winds often found the higher up you fly. This causes jerky video recording especially if the wind is hitting the NEO crosswise due to the single axis gimbal.
•After the low battery warning sounded, the battery seemed to drop pretty fast. The lower temperature likely was a factor.

Still love the NEO as it does things that I wouldn't or can't do with my camera drones but I won't be using it to replace my Mini 3 Pro any time soon.

Chris

 

[RcHawks]

As a mini 3 pro owner as well, I appreciate the feedback on your testing.

 

[Chrislaf]

As a mini 3 pro owner as well, I appreciate the feedback on your testing.

Thanks. Still want to do some more testing especially in low light situations like sunrises or sunsets to see what kind of photos or videos I can get.

One thing that I really love about the NEO is how easy it is to launch and land - there is no unfolding anything and you don’t need anything to take off or land on other than your hand. If DJI could do that with the next mini camera drone they would have a real hit.

Chris

 

[Droning on and on...]

Chris, I wonder if latitude has anything to do with the spotty GPS performance... I have much better results in Santa Cruz, CA. Getting an initial lock takes longer than other drones, but i haven't lost GPS after acquisition even indoors.

 

[Droning on and on...]

One thing that I really love about the NEO is how easy it is to launch and land - there is no unfolding anything and you don’t need anything to take off or land on other than your hand. If DJI could do that with the next mini camera drone they would have a real hit.

My gut says "no" for any drone with exposed props.

 

[NeoNeo]

Chris, I wonder if latitude has anything to do with the spotty GPS performance... I have much better results in Santa Cruz, CA. Getting an initial lock takes longer than other drones, but i haven't lost GPS after acquisition even indoors.

Just my personal experience flying the Avata2 and Neo "side by side". Launch pad identical location, launched time differential of ~1 hr. Neo takes longer to acquire satellites. Neo acquires less satellites. Neo satellite numbers some days fluctuate significantly vs. minimal to none really observed for the Avata2.

Both pick up zero to maybe 3 inside the house. Steel roof.

Assuming just a low quality GPS module in the Neo relative to the Avata2. Reflection of the significantly lower price and intended use?

 

[Chrislaf]

Chris, I wonder if latitude has anything to do with the spotty GPS performance... I have much better results in Santa Cruz, CA. Getting an initial lock takes longer than other drones, but i haven't lost GPS after acquisition even indoors.

I’m not so sure. I have flown my Mini 3 Pro and Mavic 3 Pro in this exact location numerous times and never have lost GPS. The NEO does take longer to get that initial lock and I did wait for enough satellites and the home point to be established.

The NEO does seem to have a lower quality GPS receiver likely to keep costs down and it was a very overcast and dull dark day so maybe that had an effect.

Chris

 

[Chrislaf]

My gut says "no" for any drone with exposed props.

I was thinking more along the lines that the next Mini 5 could have enclosed props but not fold and still be less than 250g. Likely not possible right now.

Will be interesting to see what specs the Flip will have.

Chris

 

[Chrislaf]

Here's a short video (no sound) from my flight yesterday that shows how the wind impacted the NEO. The conditions on the ground were calm but obviously there is more wind the higher up you fly. It shows how the crosswinds really affect the stability of the single axis gimbal and defeat the Rock Steady algorithm. When I switched out of Cruise Control, I seemed to get better control of the NEO. I plan on doing more testing with Cruise Control which my Mini 3 Pro doesn't have.

Chris